Comments on: Independence Day…Sort Of http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/ the radical way of Jesus in the Empire Wed, 10 Mar 2010 20:13:43 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: MLS_123 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-15628 MLS_123 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 05:55:20 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-15628 End the empire. Restore the republic.<br><br>Anyway, you know how many American Christians I see egging Israel on to bomb the heck out of Iran these days? Lots! They could care less about all the things scripture has to say. Politics and eschatology trumps annuls justice! End the empire. Restore the republic.

Anyway, you know how many American Christians I see egging Israel on to bomb the heck out of Iran these days? Lots! They could care less about all the things scripture has to say. Politics and eschatology trumps annuls justice!

]]> By: MLS_123 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-14397 MLS_123 Sat, 18 Jul 2009 22:55:20 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-14397 End the empire. Restore the republic.<br><br>Anyway, you know how many American Christians I see egging Israel on to bomb the heck out of Iran these days? Lots! They could care less about all the things scripture has to say. Politics and eschatology trumps annuls justice! End the empire. Restore the republic.

Anyway, you know how many American Christians I see egging Israel on to bomb the heck out of Iran these days? Lots! They could care less about all the things scripture has to say. Politics and eschatology trumps annuls justice!

]]> By: Wes Ellis http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-14365 Wes Ellis Wed, 08 Jul 2009 14:03:05 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-14365 I loved every sentence of this post! Just great stuff!!! <br>I wrote some of my own thoughts on Freedom (<a href="http://whateverisgood.blogspot.com/2009/07/thoughts-on-freedom.html" rel="nofollow">http://whateverisgood.blogspot.com/2009/07/thou...</a>) before I read this and now I know I should have just linked this article. I loved every sentence of this post! Just great stuff!!!
I wrote some of my own thoughts on Freedom (http://whateverisgood.blogspot.com/2009/07/thou...) before I read this and now I know I should have just linked this article.

]]> By: Zack Allen http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-14331 Zack Allen Sun, 05 Jul 2009 22:39:37 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-14331 Well I was always under the impression that "freedom costs a buck-o-five."<br><br>Seriously though, I think I like the heart of what you're saying here (we're offered salvation (freedom) for free), but let us not forget the great cost of that freedom. We were indeed "bought with a price." Well I was always under the impression that “freedom costs a buck-o-five.”

Seriously though, I think I like the heart of what you're saying here (we're offered salvation (freedom) for free), but let us not forget the great cost of that freedom. We were indeed “bought with a price.”

]]> By: the Jesus Manifesto » Independence day sort of at Theoblogical http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-14330 the Jesus Manifesto » Independence day sort of at Theoblogical Sun, 05 Jul 2009 16:26:19 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-14330 [...] the Jesus Manifesto » Independence day sort of [...] [...] the Jesus Manifesto » Independence day sort of [...]

]]> By: Joshua D Bau http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-14326 Joshua D Bau Sat, 04 Jul 2009 15:42:34 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-14326 I do not use twitter...sorry folks I do not use twitter…sorry folks

]]> By: Aaron R. Linderman http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-14325 Aaron R. Linderman Sat, 04 Jul 2009 13:55:27 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-14325 I think a few quotations from the ol’ Declaration of Independence may be in order:<br><br>“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights,… That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men…. We, therefore… appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do… solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States.”<br><br>Moreover, the crimes attributed to King George III include some interesting examples:<br><br>“He has… obstruct[ed] the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither….<br><br>“He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures. He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power….<br><br>“For Quartering large bodies of armed troops among us: For protecting them, by a mock Trial, from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States….<br><br>“He is at this time transporting large Armies of foreign Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.”<br><br>Justin is right that this may not exactly be Christian theology, but, Joshua, I think you would do better to argue that America has been unfaithful to the Founding, rather than arguing that the Founding is to blame for our current situation and must therefore be at odds with Christianity. I think a few quotations from the ol’ Declaration of Independence may be in order:

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights,… That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men…. We, therefore… appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do… solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States.”

Moreover, the crimes attributed to King George III include some interesting examples:

“He has… obstruct[ed] the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither….

“He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures. He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power….

“For Quartering large bodies of armed troops among us: For protecting them, by a mock Trial, from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States….

“He is at this time transporting large Armies of foreign Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.”

Justin is right that this may not exactly be Christian theology, but, Joshua, I think you would do better to argue that America has been unfaithful to the Founding, rather than arguing that the Founding is to blame for our current situation and must therefore be at odds with Christianity.

]]> By: paul munn http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-14324 paul munn Sat, 04 Jul 2009 12:28:44 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-14324 I just put together an evening prayer that we will do here next week (answering the independence day rhetoric of this weekend). I used several Psalters songs, with us singing the "Home, Home" part of "Refugee," and asked one of the young guys here to do some drumming for us.<br><br>If you're interested, the prayer is available here: <a href="http://cimarronline.blogspot.com/2009/07/prayer-of-dependence_04.html" rel="nofollow">"Prayer of Dependence"</a> I just put together an evening prayer that we will do here next week (answering the independence day rhetoric of this weekend). I used several Psalters songs, with us singing the “Home, Home” part of “Refugee,” and asked one of the young guys here to do some drumming for us.

If you're interested, the prayer is available here: “Prayer of Dependence”

]]> By: justin http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-14323 justin Sat, 04 Jul 2009 03:03:13 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-14323 I'm pretty sure that our founding documents state that that freedoms they laid out are granted from our creator... the government was there essentially to be the violent arm of God to protect those rights. Still not a correct understanding of things, but originally it was better than what we now how (the government exists to protect us from everything, even our own stupidity)<br><br>its just too bad that the citizens of this nation don't believe that anymore. blind trust in authority typically leads to negative ends. I'm pretty sure that our founding documents state that that freedoms they laid out are granted from our creator… the government was there essentially to be the violent arm of God to protect those rights. Still not a correct understanding of things, but originally it was better than what we now how (the government exists to protect us from everything, even our own stupidity)

its just too bad that the citizens of this nation don't believe that anymore. blind trust in authority typically leads to negative ends.

]]> By: Monique http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/2009/07/independence-day-sort-of/comment-page-1/#comment-14322 Monique Fri, 03 Jul 2009 21:44:10 +0000 http://www.jesusmanifesto.com/?p=3045#comment-14322 Bravo! Bravo!

]]>